To Vacchagotta on Fire Aggi-vacchagotta Sutta (MN 72)
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('â', The cosmos is eternal: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthlessâ?" " ⦠noâ¦" "Then does Master Gotama hold the view: ),
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('â', The cosmos is not eternal: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthlessâ?" " ⦠noâ¦" "Then does Master Gotama hold the view: ),
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('â', The cosmos is finite: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthlessâ?" " ⦠noâ¦" "Then does Master Gotama hold the view: ),
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('â', The cosmos is infinite: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthlessâ?" " ⦠noâ¦" "Then does Master Gotama hold the view: ),
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('â', The soul & the body are the same: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthlessâ?" " ⦠noâ¦" "Then does Master Gotama hold the view: ),
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('â', The soul is one thing and the body another: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthlessâ?" " ⦠noâ¦" "Then does Master Gotama hold the view: ),
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('â', After death a Tathṅgata exists: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthlessâ?" " ⦠noâ¦" "Then does Master Gotama hold the view: ),
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('â', After death a Tathṅgata does not exist: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthlessâ?" " ⦠no â¦" "Then does Master Gotama hold the view: ),
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('â', After death a Tathṅgata both exists & does not exist: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthlessâ?" " ⦠noâ¦" "Then does Master Gotama hold the view: ),
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('â', After death a Tathṅgata neither exists nor does not exist: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthlessâ?" " ⦠noâ¦" "How is it, Master Gotama, when Master Gotama is asked if he holds the view ),
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('â', the cosmos is eternalâ¦â ⦠),
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('â', after death a Tathṅgata neither exists nor does not exist: only this is true, anything otherwise is worthless,â he says ),
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('â', ⦠noâ¦â in each case. Seeing what drawback, then, is Master Gotama thus entirely dissociated from each of these ten positions?" "Vaccha, the position that ),
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('â', the cosmos is eternalâ is a thicket of views, a wilderness of views, a contortion of views, a writhing of views, a fetter of views. It is accompanied by suffering, distress, despair, & fever, and it does not lead to disenchantment, dispassion, cessation; to calm, direct knowledge, self-awakening, unbinding. "The position that ),
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('â', the cosmos is not eternalâ⦠"â¦),
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('â', the cosmos is finiteâ⦠"â¦),
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('â', the cosmos is infiniteâ⦠"â¦),
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('â', the soul & the body are the sameâ⦠"â¦),
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('â', the soul is one thing and the body anotherâ⦠"â¦),
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('â', after death a Tathṅgata existsâ⦠"â¦),
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('â', after death a Tathṅgata does not existâ⦠"â¦),
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('â', after death a Tathṅgata both exists & does not existâ⦠"â¦),
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('â', after death a Tathṅgata neither exists nor does not existâ⦠does not lead to disenchantment, dispassion, cessation; to calm, direct knowledge, self-awakening, unbinding." "Does Master Gotama have any position at all?" "A ),
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('â', position,â Vaccha, is something that a Tathṅgata has done away with. What a Tathṅgata sees is this: ),
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('â', Such is form, such its origination, such its disappearance; such is feeling, such its origination, such its disappearance; such is perception⦠such are fabrications⦠such is consciousness, such its origination, such its disappearance.â Because of this, I say, a Tathṅgata—with the ending, fading away, cessation, renunciation, & relinquishment of all suppositions, all excogitations, all I-making & mine-making & obsessions with conceit—is, through lack of clinging/sustenance, released." "But, Master Gotama, the monk whose mind is thus released: Where does he reappear?" "),
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('â', Reappear,â Vaccha, doesnât apply." "In that case, Master Gotama, he does not reappear." "),
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('â', Does not reappear,â Vaccha, doesnât apply." "â¦both does & does not reappear." "â¦doesnât apply." "â¦neither does nor does not reappear." "â¦doesnât apply." "How is it, Master Gotama, when Master Gotama is asked if the monk reappears⦠does not reappear⦠both does & does not reappear⦠neither does nor does not reappear, he says, ),
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('â', ⦠doesnât applyâ in each case. At this point, Master Gotama, I am befuddled; at this point, confused. The modicum of clarity coming to me from your earlier conversation is now obscured." "Of course youâre befuddled, Vaccha. Of course youâre confused. Deep, Vaccha, is this phenomenon, hard to see, hard to realize, tranquil, refined, beyond the scope of conjecture, subtle, to-be-experienced by the wise. For those with other views, other practices, other satisfactions, other aims, other teachers, it is difficult to know. That being the case, I will counter-question you on this matter. Answer as you see fit. What do you think, Vaccha? If a fire were burning in front of you, would you know that ),
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('â', This fire is burning in front of meâ?" "â¦yesâ¦" "And if someone were to ask you, Vaccha, ),
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('â', This fire burning in front of you, dependent on what is it burning?â: Thus asked, how would you reply?" "â¦I would reply, ),
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('â', This fire burning in front of me is burning dependent on grass & timber as its sustenance.â" "If the fire burning in front of you were to go out, would you know that, ),
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('â', This fire burning in front of me has gone outâ?" "â¦yesâ¦" "And if someone were to ask you, ),
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('â', This fire that has gone out in front of you, in which direction from here has it gone? East? West? North? Or south?â: Thus asked, how would you reply?" "That doesnât apply, Master Gotama. Any fire burning dependent on a sustenance of grass & timber, being unnourished—from having consumed that sustenance and not being offered any other—is classified simply as ),
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('â', outâ [unbound]." "In the same way, Vaccha, any form by which one describing the Tathṅgata would describe him: That the Tathṅgata has abandoned, its root destroyed, made like a palmyra stump, deprived of the conditions of development, not destined for future arising. Freed from the classification of form, Vaccha, the Tathṅgata is deep, boundless, hard to fathom, like the sea. ),
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('â', Reappearsâ doesnât apply. ),
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('â', Does not reappearâ doesnât apply. ),
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('â', Both does & does not reappearâ doesnât apply. ),
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('â', Neither reappears nor does not reappearâ doesnât apply. "Any feeling.⦠Any perception.⦠Any fabrication.⦠"Any consciousness by which one describing the Tathṅgata would describe him: That the Tathṅgata has abandoned, its root destroyed, made like a palmyra stump, deprived of the conditions of development, not destined for future arising. Freed from the classification of consciousness, Vaccha, the Tathṅgata is deep, boundless, hard to fathom, like the sea. ),
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('â', Reappearsâ doesnât apply. ),
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('â', Does not reappearâ doesnât apply. ),
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('â', Both does & does not reappearâ doesnât apply. ),
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('â', Neither reappears nor does not reappearâ doesnât apply." When this was said, Vacchagotta the wanderer said to the Blessed One: "Master Gotama, itâs as if there were a great Sal tree not far from a village or town: From inconstancy, its branches and leaves would wear away, its bark would wear away, its sapwood would wear away, so that on a later occasion—divested of branches, leaves, bark, & sapwood—it would stand as pure heartwood. In the same way, Master Gotamaâs words are divested of branches, leaves, bark, & sapwood and stand as pure heartwood. "Magnificent, Master Gotama! Magnificent! Just as if he were to place upright what was overturned, to reveal what was hidden, to show the way to one who was lost, or to carry a lamp into the dark so that those with eyes could see forms, in the same way has Master Gotama—through many lines of reasoning—made the Dhamma clear. I go to Master Gotama for refuge, to the Dhamma, and to the Saṃgha of monks. May Master Gotama remember me as a lay follower who has gone to him for refuge, from this day forward, for life." See also: DN 15; MN 29–30; SN 6:15; SN 22:36; SN 22:85–86; SN 23:2; SN 44:1; SN 44:9; AN 4:24; AN 10:81; AN 10:93; Ud 8:9–10; Iti 63; Iti 112; Sn 5:6; Thig 5:10 - --> - - - -